Re: [MW:12994] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

Dear Mr. Henning and Dr. Dilintas,

My interpretation to this (in blue text below) is the same as yours. :-)

Thanks for your intervention in bringing this to rest.

Regards,
Sadique
Sent from BlackBerry® Excuse typos

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From: John Henning <jhenning@deltak.com>

Sender: "materials-welding@googlegroups.com" <materials-welding@googlegroups.com>

Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2011 08:45:28 -0800

To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com<materials-welding@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: "materials-welding@googlegroups.com" <materials-welding@googlegroups.com>

Subject: RE: [MW:12992] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

Jun

 

Hope this puts this manner to bed.  Dr. Dilintas is correct!    Sadique needs to become more familiar with ASME Section IX.

 

{As noted - the Group number is only a supplementary essential variable,  i.e. applies only when impact testing is required.}

 

READ the final portion of QW-403.5  to whit " . . . when base metals of two different P-Number Group Number combinations are qualified using a single test coupon, that coupon qualified the welding of those two P-Number Group Numbers to themselves as well as to each other using the variables qualified.  . . ."

 

Also see Interpretation IX-79-94.  Note information below is from the HSB Web Site and should not be copied to any other document or reproduced in any other manner.

 

ASME Code Interpretations

Choose the scope of the list of Code Interpretations you wish to see:

Back

Status:

Currently Valid

Status Description: See QW-403.5(c) in current Code (2010 ed.)

Interpretation:	IX-79-94
Subject:	Section IX, QW-403.5 Qualification of Welding Procedure with Notch Toughness in Materials of the Same P-Number but Different Group Numbers
Date Issued:	October 9, 1979
File Number:	BC-79-630
Related Documents:

Question: Is it the intent of QW-403.5 to permit qualification of two different Group number materials within the same P-Number welded to themselves by welding one Group material to the other Group material and impact testing the heat affected zone on both sides of the weld and the weld metal?

Reply: Yes, provided the same essential variables, including electrodes of filler metals, are used when welding each base metal Group to itself.

The above interpretation was transcribed by HSB Code Services from the official publications [ASME published volumes, National Board, Eurodyne]. Although every effort was made to accurately reproduce this interpretation, use of this information should be for research only. It is strongly recommended that the official published document be used for Code business.

 

Please let me know if you have any additional questions.

 

 

 

John A. Henning

Welding & Materials

 

From: materials-welding@googlegroups.com [mailto:materials-welding@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jr. Chiong
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2011 7:25 AM
To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [MW:12987] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

 

Dr. Georgio,

 

What is the correct one? Please provide for the benefit of us who also intrigue with this matter.

 

Thanks a lot.

 

Jun

 

 

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From: "george.dilintas@gr.bureauveritas.com" <george.dilintas@gr.bureauveritas.com>
To: materials-welding <materials-welding@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, 14 November 2011, 17:15:33
Subject: Re: [MW:12979] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

Sorry dear fellow but your conclusion is not correct
Best regards
Dr Georgios Dilintas
Authorized Nuclear Inspector
Authorized Inspector Supervisor
HBS Regional Technical Manager

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  From: sevak hiren [hirensevak80@gmail.com]
  Sent: 14/11/2011 15:25 ZE5B
  To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com
  Subject: Re: [MW:12976] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

 

Dear concern,

 

In this case if you have PQR with P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 1 combination with impact testing.

 

The following combinations with same PQR For impact application. -  CAN NOT BE USED

1) P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 2
2) P No-1 Gr No-1 to P No1 Gr 1
3) P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 1

 

But, as per QW-403.5

 

If you have two W{PS/PQR for P No-1 Gr No-1 to P No1 Gr 1 and P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 1 or 2 combination with impact testing., then only the above combinations are allowed.

 

QW - 403.5 clearlly states that a procedure qual. shall be made for each P No. Gr No combination of base metals, even though pro. qual. tests have been made for each of the two base metals welded to itself. 

 

On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 11:18 AM, Sadique Basha <s-basha@velosi.com> wrote:

Dear Vijay,

 

Please refer to QW-403.5 of ASME Sec IX.

 

It states " When base metals of two different P-Number Group Number combinations are qualified using a single test coupon, that coupon qualifies the welding of these two P-Number Group Numbers to themselves as well as to each other using the variables qualified."

 

Hope this helps.

 

Regards,

Sadique

 

From: materials-welding@googlegroups.com [mailto:materials-welding@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Vijay Katkar
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 9:30 PM
To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com; nandeshkumar@rocketmail.com
Subject: Re: [MW:12969] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

 

Dear Nandesh,

Thanks for reply

But if toughness requirement is applicable then group number will be essential variable. as per QW 252 change in group number call for qualification.
please give me any reference in the section IX.

Regards

vijay katkar 

On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 4:09 PM, Nandesh Kumar <nandeshkumar@rocketmail.com> wrote:

YES. 

As per SEC IX, any combination of P1, G1 materials can be welded in any combination to P2, G2, provided Impact test requirements are fulfilled.

 

Nandesh

 

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From: Madhusudan Rout <madhusudan.rout@gmail.com>
To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sunday, 13 November 2011 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: [MW:12964] Supplementary essential variable - Group number As per section IX

 

Yes  u can use As per SEC-9. QW-420, base metal grouping, 2010 edition.

 

 

 

On Sat, Nov 12, 2011 at 9:14 PM, Vijay Katkar <katkar.vijay22@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear All,

please sheared your valuable experience for following situation,

I have PQR with P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 1 combination with impact testing. Can i use following combination with same PQR For impact application.

1) P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 2
2) P No-1 Gr No-1 to P No1 Gr 1
3) P No-1 Gr No-2 to P No1 Gr 1

If above combination's are possible please provide code reference of ASME section IX or ASME section VIII.

Regards
Vijay Katkar

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Thanks & Regards

Hiren Sevak
Surveyor
Bureau Veritas - Ahmedabad
207, Abhishree
Opp Star India Bazaar,
Satellite Road,
Ahmedabad-380015
Tel No. 079-26925491/92

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