Re: [MW:12144] Repair procedure on severely punctured root

 

Dear  Mr.Murugesan,

 

 Let the codes and standards be aside,

 

I request you to answer my question,

 

What we can do in such cases if the final hardness value of the joint (particularly at HAZ) is higher than the acceptable limits???

 

please keep in mind that particular joint after repair ,RT is accepted .But we need to get the hardness value in acceptable limits ....!!!

with regards,

sudhakar.k 

On Sun, Aug 7, 2011 at 3:02 PM, murugesan jeyaraman <jmurugesan@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear All

 

Eventhough if this is considered as weld build up or buttering, still PWHT is not required. This is only a small portion of 10 to 15 mm length for repair.

"Thickness of base metal  restored to get the required weld  bevel" can be  welded by following qualified Butt weld WPS . If no PWHT is required for WPS, no PWHT required for production weld also.

 

Even if you consider, cooling rate would be faster - We can apply pre-heat to 95 C then we can start welding.  No martensite formation will  happen, here. Doing PWHT will add cost.

 

Since it is a P1 material with thickness 12.7 mm, no PWHT is required,

 

As per ASME sec I and B31.3 - PWHT governing thickness is 19 mm (through thicness direction)

 

As per ASME Sec VIII div 1, UCS-56 - PWHT required only above 38 mm thickness , 32 mm to 38 mm - PWHT not required if Pre-heated at 95 Degree.

 

UW-42 SURFACE WELD METAL BUILDUP (ASME VIII Div 1 - 2010 Edition)

 

Construction in which deposits of weld metal are applied

to the surface of base metal for the purpose of:

 

(a) restoring the thickness of the base metal for strength

    consideration; or

(b) modifying the configuration of weld joints in order

    to provide the tapered transition requirements of UW-9(c)

    and UW-33(b) shall be performed in accordance with the

(1) A butt welding procedure qualification in accordance

    with provisions of Section IX must be performed for

    the thickness of weld metal deposited, prior to production

    welding.

(2) All weld metal buildup must be examined over

    the full surface of the deposit by either magnetic particle

    examination to the requirements of Appendix 6, or by liquid

    penetrant examination to the requirements of Appendix 8.

    When such surface weld metal buildup is used in welded

    joints which require full or spot radiographic examination,

    the weld metal buildup shall be included in the examination

 

Thanks and regards

J. Murugesan

On Sun, Aug 7, 2011 at 1:01 AM, sudhakar kuppuswamy <mechsudhakar@gmail.com> wrote:

 

 Dear all,

                      Further to Mr Ramin Kondori comments, I like to add some more point to this discussion, I too suggest PWHT for that joint, since repair weld buttering or built up with GTAW, the deposit of weld metal will be in small layer .So cooling rate will so high which may leads to martensite formation (Hard structure), more over HAZ would have been subjected to uncontrolled heating and cooling during initial and repair welding.

               So It will be better to carry out a PWHT on that Joint by studying the  design temperatures& mechanical properties requirements. If toughness requirement is there it always better to do  a PWHT. 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: sami ali <sami_irq@yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: [MW:12131] Repair procedure on severely punctured root
To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com

Yes you need to do PWHT after checking  that the hardness is out of the tolerance value after welding. I think if you weld the root and hot by GTAW +filling by SMAW you will pass. Regards SAMI --- On Fri, 8/5/11, Ramin Kondori <raminkondori@gmail.com> wrote: From: Ramin Kondori <raminkondori@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [MW:12125] Repair procedure on severely punctured root To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com Date: Friday, August 5, 2011, 9:58 PM Wherever you have large amount of welding, you need PWHT... If you have a standard joint, then 19mm or 25mm criteria roles for PWHT but when the gap is 10-12 mm then the weld volume is high enough to call for a PWHT You can draw a sketch and calculate the volume of the weld in a 19mm thick pipe, then draw a sketch of you joint with 10-12 mm gap and you will see the weld volume is much more... Of course it is a matter of engineering judgement. You should consider you fluid, process parameters like temperature, pressure and design requirements. In my opinion if your specifications requires PWHT for thicknesses above 19mm (for this line) then you should probably carry out PWHT because of your weld metal volume.   Regards Ramin  Kondori    QC/Welding Engineer           IWE AT 0070     On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 9:29 PM, pgoswami <pgoswami@quickclic.net> wrote: Ramin.   Why PWHT? Does a weld thickness of 12.7 mm on  SA 106 Gr B base metal require any PWHT as per any commonly referred boiler and pressure vessel code?   I would think the suggestion of Prem Nautiyal is the way to go.   The technique referred is" common bridging technique" to close in wide-root gaps, which is quite common for manual GTAW. Using 6010 with 10-12 mm root gap would not be safe , as the welder would not be able to control the weld puddle.Hence GTAW would be the preferred technique to bridge the root and proceed further.   Thanks.   Pradip Goswami,P.Eng.IWE Welding & Metallurgical Specialist & Consultant Ontario,Canada. Email-pgoswami@sympatico.ca, pgoswami@quickclic.net   From: materials-welding@googlegroups.com [mailto:materials-welding@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ramin Kondori Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 11:10 AM To: materials-welding@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [MW:12121] Repair procedure on severely punctured root It's better to apply PWHT after completion of the weld. Regards Ramin  Kondori    QC/Welding Engineer           IWE AT 0070     On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 12:50 PM, prem nautiyal <prem_nautiyal26@yahoo.com> wrote: Yes you can do weld buildup on the punctured rootface by ER70S-2 (TIG) till you get a uniform root gap of @3mm. Then weld the root run with ER70S-2 and complete the joint with E7018 provided you have a WPS / PQR for the same.   Regards   Prem Nautiyal --- On Fri, 8/5/11, limesh M <limesh78@gmail.com> wrote: From: limesh M <limesh78@gmail.com> Subject: [MW:12110] Repair procedure on severely punctured root To: "Materials & Welding" <materials-welding@googlegroups.com> Date: Friday, August 5, 2011, 10:45 AM Dear All, Material : ASTM A106 Gr. B Thickness : 12.70 mm Welding Process : SMAW Electrodes used as per approved WPS : SFA 5.1, E6010 (Root)+ SFA 5.1, E7018(Fill&Cap) During through thickness repair, by mistake root pass has been punctured badly(5-8cm in length after complete removal).Unfortunately,now the root gap is almost 10-12 mm wide and it is difficult to weld root again with E6010.In this case what is the better option other than cut and bevel the joint.Is there any problem to build root with GTAW by using ER 70S2 and fill remaining thickness with 7018? Regards, Limesh -- To post to this group, send email to materials-welding@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to materials-welding+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group's bolg at http://materials-welding.blogspot.com/ The views expressed/exchnaged in this group are members personel views and meant for educational purposes only, Users must take their own decisions w.r.t. applicable code/standard/contract documents. -- To post to this group, send email to materials-welding@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to materials-welding+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group's bolg at http://materials-welding.blogspot.com/ The views expressed/exchnaged in this group are members personel views and meant for educational purposes only, Users must take their own decisions w.r.t. applicable code/standard/contract documents. -- To post to this group, send email to materials-welding@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to materials-welding+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group's bolg at http://materials-welding.blogspot.com/ The views expressed/exchnaged in this group are members personel views and meant for educational purposes only, Users must take their own decisions w.r.t. applicable code/standard/contract documents. -- To post to this group, send email to materials-welding@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to materials-welding+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group's bolg at http://materials-welding.blogspot.com/ The views expressed/exchnaged in this group are members personel views and meant for educational purposes only, Users must take their own decisions w.r.t. applicable code/standard/contract documents. -- To post to this group, send email to materials-welding@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to materials-welding+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group's bolg at http://materials-welding.blogspot.com/ The views expressed/exchnaged in this group are members personel views and meant for educational purposes only, Users must take their own decisions w.r.t. applicable code/standard/contract documents.

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--
With regards,
Sudhakar.k

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--
With regards,
Sudhakar.k

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